The discussion started on the state militia. I explained the age guidelines for Ks. and Mo. I then stated that we older and disabled could still form a defense line of last resistance. If it would come to this, it wouldn't matter if they did bring in the Black Hawks because we would be the last patriots standing. And I will never accept an enemies terms of surrender. I come from a long line of patriots and of our founding fathers and cannot accept the fact that our nation is being stolen from us one liberty at a time. If it comes to a choice of living under oppression or dying for the cause of liberty, I, then will die with my weapon in my hand. I do not surrender.

Hi

I think that Robert is not aware of the fact that we are thinking about defensive issues, an how we can organize should that eventuality happen. none of us want to attack anyone. However it is pretty clear that about 65-70 million gun owners are not going to give up their weapons, and violate their Second Amendment rights.

We, as citizens, have not been tested as a nation since the Revolutionary War, and interestingly we were not a nation at that time. It is very difficult to imagine that we, citizens and Americans would even be thinking about steps as drastic as those discussed here and on many other sites.

Relative to Blackhawks and turning our homes into toothpicks: Many believe that the US Army will never fire on citizens defending their homes. I am not sure this if the case, but according to many who have far more military experience than I have, that would be true. I certainly hope this is the case. I suppose one should plan fo toothpicks and hope for reason and patriotism to prevail, as foolish as that may sound to some.

For the moment, we need to organize into political militias. What is a political militia? Simply a group - hopefully a large group - of people who inundate their representatives with emails, letters, faxes, and whatever and let them know we will not stand for losing our Second amendment rights, Eric Holder and the Brady group notwithstanding!

Let's remember that all here can play a role. Perhaps Robert, an folks like Robert, can lead the effort that is more diplomatic and causes the politicians to believe that there is a groundswell of millions of people who oppose the plans to remove us from our constitutional rights. Others can plan do do more research into how other means might be studied, and subsequently used, to protect us, and our loved ones, from the hegemony of the Left.

Jerry Dean

Great James. I appreciate the dedication. I too have relatives from the 1600s. Please, in the mean time, educate our young about good and evil and motivate those old enough to know good from evil.

Hi Jerry, Thank you for your comment. As you can see, I am a state coordinator. I am working on five sites to find people who will work; do something more than talk or dream of shooting our guns.

Your second from the last paragraph is an ultimate statement of patriotism. I applaud you for it.

Robert and Jerry, Remember the old saying; "It is the soldier that hates war the most, for it is the soldier that must bear the scars of war, for the rest of his life!"
Of these I have some! I do not want war and am trying my best to educate, but this is a difficult job with the schools teaching a misguided doctrine of socialism. Living in a rural area with a population base of 14 people per square mile, it is difficult to reach many.

I have a beloved son and another man whom I consider a brother. Both bear the scars of war and my heart hurts with their hearts and with yours, James. What resource do you need? Can you reach local people; phone, poster in yard, you name it.

I have grandchildren in more rural schools (I am familiar with Seattle) and they see much less indoctrination so I hope your area is similarly "deprived".

Again, my deepest appreciation for your service and heartache for your scars. I will help you help.

Are you folks familiar with PatriotHeartsNetwork? I am listening now (it is here)?

Jerry, Robert, James and Dave,
I appreciate all of you for being patriots. After trying to follow your conversation for a while, it becomes clear that you all would be very interested in the committees of safety. Please read Constitutional Homeland Security, by Dr. Edwin Vieira. From the Committees of Safety dot org web page, listen to the audio recordings of previous conference calls, particularly episode 3 and episode 6 are extremely educational. Or, order their dvds from the Connecticut Committees of Safety meetings. Truly, these are safety and security that begins and ends in your own community. The Committees of Safety is also in support of sound money bills and sovereignty resolutions, but goes way beyond that. It has been mentioned that eventually they could bring about election reform for truly honest and transparent elections. I beg you, do some listening and reading, I'm sure you will want to get behind this effort. Devvy Kidd has also written about them. Their conference call is Wednesday evening at 9 pm EST. Link on their web page will allow you to listen free via internet. These are urgent for everyone, and we have zero time to waste. This effort needs men like you all.
http://www.committeesofsafety.org/

Thank you, Jin. I will add this to the list of wonderful reading and listening that there is to do.

In my area the schools would rather teach football strategy than history. Out of a population of 9200 in the county, most are farmers. Only about 21% of those are young people. Those over 50 are the greater number. We have 7 towns in the county and four schools. No major business and nothing to hold the youth after graduation unless they work on the farm or in their parents business.
As far as My needs, I have none. I am still mobile to a degree and strive each day to make some headway in helping our local youth, in any way I can.

I am from a town in Idaho that had a population of 1500 for dozens of years. There were lots of farmers and ranchers around. I, like many of my classmates, left because there was no work there.

About 50 miles south of where I live now there is a rancher who has a big sign board (visible from the freeway) and he puts short and pointed messages on it. One governor asked the state police to take it down but they were somehow convinced otherwise.

Somehow this reminds me of the day that my father came home from fighting fires. He had been out for two weeks with no bath. He was just filling the tub when the local police shut our water off for non-payment. He put on his holster belt, seated the 44 magnum in it, and walked out and suggested that the water be unpadlocked, then went in and finished his bath.

Sounds like my dad, a retired WW II army Sargent. I was raised in boot camp.

JinOhio et al:

I am a member of http://www.committeesofsafety.org/ already.

I strongly suggest that each of you join and help all of your friends to consider joining.

Jerry Dean

Don't forget - The Committees of Safety conference call is happening right now. 9 pm EST.
http://www.committeesofsafety.org/conference-call/


I just learned of a similar group in Richland County Ohio. See Ohio Action Group for that info.
Thanks all!
God Bless, keep praying.

What is all these committees & meetings going to do? Are we getting ready to march??Gp

hey guys go here and read this http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/8835

Clyde et al:

Please send this to all, I repeat all your mailing list. Regardless of whether or not those people are Democrats or Republicans or whatever, most will not put up with Nazi like tactics. Send it to all websites, all radio shows, and everywhere it may have a chance of being noticed.

This cannot be allowed to happen here. What has it got to do with gun control? Everything, because as they take control of the populace, the gun control rhetoric will become more and more hysterical...and unfortunately more effective.

Again here is the link Clyde has provided:http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/8835

Jerry Dean

Gary,
I think there are a couple of different organizations planning to march in DC and then there are tea parties being organized all over the country for right now, and in March.

The Committees of Safety are an effort to return government to local and state self-governing. The federal government is way out of control and un Constitutional, as we all know. Immediately, the federal reserve notes need to be replaced with real money. Committees of safety advocate sound money bills at the state legislation level, state sovereignty and eventually state legislation to re-establish the Constitutional local safety committees to be in place in case of a natural or man-made disaster. Think safety of water and food supply, safety in travel, emergency assistance, 2nd amendment rights. Think neighborhood watch groups on steroids. Homeland security that begins and ends in your own community. Eventually (this has been mentioned as an idea) they might even help restore honest and transparent elections -- paper ballots with results counted publicly posted at each precinct. There are provisions in the Constitution for each state to establish and organize these committees.

For more detailed explanation, read up on the web page, watch the video trailers posted at the web page, read Dr. Vieira's book Constitutional Homeland Security, volume 1, or watch a dvd of the Boston Tea Party held last year. There are also articles posted by Dr. Vieira at News with Views.com You may also listen to previous conference calls for detailed discussion of how these will work. I found episode 3 to be very educational.

I hope this helps to answer your question.

We don't have much time, the sound money bills are the most urgent matter, I believe.

Sounds to me like your trying to fight a "paper war"! You an all of us know that Washington has been out of control since the Clinton era and none of these so called "leaders" have paid attention to our Constitution unless it suits them. The only way I can see to get our country back is to march on Washington like a revolt. Gp

Gary,
These folks are organizing a march to DC. Date later this year, I think?
http://www.resistnet.com/

This group is organizing a march to include various gun rights groups. A march, not a takeover.
http://secondamendmentmarch.com/index.htm

I think if you look into the Committees of Safety, you will understand that it absolutely IS about taking our country back, by reclaiming safety and security and governing in your own community. Please read up on their web page. The COS are not about letter writing. They are about enacting state legislation to return to the Constitutional rule of law. Much about property rights and 2nd amendment rights. What state are you in? The several states who are considering sovereignty resolutions will certainly have groups already working to reclaim control, self-governing, and want the federal government to butt out.

One urgent part of that is getting your state to do business in sound money. So, when the federal reserve notes collapse you and your state will have money that is worth something. http://www.constitutionaltender.com/
and
http://goldmoneybill.org/

God Bless you!

And, Gary, I forgot to mention again, the We The People Foundation and Congress are planning a Continental Congress this summer. This will be a landmark event also, because that group has been taking the gov't to court for years. The 1st amendment right to petition for redress of grievance is their core issue and the delegates from 50 states to the CC2009 will determine what their next steps will be. Their web page is very informative.
http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/default.htm

The repeated injuries against the right to petition have proven that the elected officials and gov't agencies refuse to answer and the courts have said they don't have to answer, and the last time those words were written was the Declaration of Independence. This will be an important event. Please consider supporting it in any way possible.

check out these vids


CPAC Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slB4932KOW8
CPAC Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpfIG5bkbDU

Hi

There is indeed a group of people on ResistNet going to Washington.

Here is the link: http://www.resistnet.com/group/wethepeoplemarchonwashington

Jerry Dean

NRA member here! As Charlton Heston said, "When they take it from my cold dead fingers," or so. The gun-grabbers are out in full force, but we will NOT let them take down the 2nd Amendment. Have you heard how crime has increased since Austrailia just did the grab the guns from law-abiding citizens? For some ODD reason, liberals have this delusion that criminals will abide by the law and turn in their guns! They have everything, and I do mean everything backward.

Its not about taking our guns to get rid of crime, they want complete control over us and to keep their eliet ass in power forever! Gp

i saw this post yesterday in another forum ---
Just came back from the gun range where we were testing out a new 9 mm I bought today. While there we talked with a group of ex military private security men who told us their counterparts had been asked to help FEMA draw up plans for home invasions to confiscate weapons. They also said that as soon as the legislation was passed the Fema plan would be fully operational ready within 2-3 weeks for a full scale deployment. Damn, this is beyond scary.
sounds like the blood bath will start sooner than we expected - better have your firearms hidden and/or at the ready for instant use !!!

The private security men, who are their counterparts and even if FEMA does have a plan to do this would they have enough people to cover the United States? My God there must be 10.0000.000 guns here just in Ohio ! garypoling64@yahoo.com

Gary, that may be true - but how many are willing to shoot fema troops in order to keep their guns???? i would guess about 1 %

Liberals have no delusion about criminals abiding by gun laws, DonnR. They are criminals and are working to promote chaos so they can increase the income to the government and scrape more off the top for themselves. Please, everyone, get the delusion that the liberals are deluded out of your mind. They are not. They thrive on chaos.

Dave, If someone comes on my land FEMA or others to ride roughshod over me they cannot be considerd Americans and I will defend rights and will FEMA troops shoot at Americans? Then shoot back just like the theif that is breaking in your house. Too bad their are "weak kneed guys " that say they are American..Gp

Gary, FEMA has already shown they will follow orders of their bosses _remember New Orleans_ ! but i too believe that if anyone comes on my land against my second amendment rights there will be blood shed and most all us old vets feel this way. this is not russia or france and we will not willingly give up our constitution and bill of rights !! the poser in the white house will be ousted eventually and his thugs will not win , but it will be very nasty !!

LET ER RIP! Gp

http://www.oath-keepers.blogspot.com/

WND Exclusive WEAPONS OF CHOICE
Feds undercut civilian supply of ammunition
Policy leaves manufacturers without brass for cartridges
Posted: March 17, 2009
9:00 pm Eastern

By Drew Zahn
© 2009 WorldNetDaily

http://wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=92095


Fired brass shell casings

A recent government policy change has taken a bite out of the nation's already stressed ammunition supply, leaving arms dealers scrambling to find ammo for private gun owners.

Georgia Arms is a company that for the last 15 years has been purchasing fired brass shell casings from the Department of Defense and private government surplus liquidators. The military collects the discarded casings from fired rounds, then sells them through liquidators to companies like Georgia Arms that remanufacture the casings into ammunition for the law enforcement and civilian gun owner communities.

But earlier this month, Georgia Arms received a canceled order, informed by its supplier that the government now requires fired brass casings be mutilated, in other words, destroyed to a scrap metal state.

The policy change, handed down from the Department of Defense through the Defense Logistics Agency, cuts a supply leg out from underneath ammunition manufacturers.

Learn here why it's your right -- and duty -- to be armed.

The policy has compelled Georgia Arms, for example, to cancel all sales of .223 and .308 ammunition, rounds used, respectively, in semi-automatic and deer hunting rifles, until further notice. Sharch Manufacturing, Inc. has announced the same cancellation of its .223 and .308 brass reloading components.

"They just reclassified brass to allow destruction of it, based on what?" Georgia Arms owner Larry Haynie asked WND. "We've been 'going green' for the last dozen years, and brass is one of the most recyclable materials out there. A cartridge case can be used over and over again. And now we're going to destroy it based on what? We don't want the civilian public to have it? It's a government injustice."

(Story continues below)

i read a couple articles today that say that policy is canceled already as they recieved MANY MANY complaints !!!!

This is going to be a rough four years! If we last that long..Gp

WGN radio on Thursday March 26, 2009
This from www.SecondAmendmentMarch.com e-newsletter

URGENT! Anti-gun Chicago talk show host Milt Rosenberg will be hosting a radio debate on the REPEAL of the 2nd Amendment to our Constitution on superstation WGN Radio.

WGN has a huge market and can be heard on air in many states and around the world streaming live on the internet....this is not just an Illinois issue. (Note that if you cannot click on the link directly, copy and paste the entire link into your browser's address bar.)
http://www.wgnradio.com/index.php?option=com_google_maps&Itemid...

The following is taken from an urgent email just issued by the Illinois State Rifle Association. This is a TRIAL BALLOON people. Don't forget where Obama came from....Chicago. If you care at all about freedom then you recognize that an on air debate about abolishing the 2nd Amendment is the shot across the bow. Read and respond:

\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
Defending our Constitution will be Bob Levy, Chairman of the Cato Institute.

The debater who will be attacking our Constitution has not been named as of yet.

HERE IS WHAT YOU MUST DO TO DEFEND YOUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS:

1. Mark your calendar to listen to WGN Radio, AM 720, on Thursday, March 26, 2009 beginning at 9 PM. If you cannot receive WGN in your area, you can listen to the program live on the Internet at www.wgnradio.com

2. No matter where you live, please be sure to call the radio station's call in line at (312) 591-7200 and ask to speak your opinion on what has been said. It would be best if you voice support for the 2nd Amendment and Mr. Levy's statements rather than personally attacking whoever the anti gunner is.

3. Please pass this alert on to all your gun-owning, freedom-loving friends, your gun club, and anyone else you know who would be interested in calling in to the radio show to defend our Constitution.

4. Please post this alert to any and all Internet bulletin boards or blogs to which you subscribe.

It is important that you call the radio station and continue to call until you get through to speak. The more pro-gun callers we get, the better. Don't let the anti gunners use this forum as a vehicle for trampling on our Constitution!

Let's do what we can to generate a nation-wide response to this latest attack on our rights!

'That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to abolish it'. You get the point. Thats from the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence. People must start getting active and spreading the word. Our elected leaders have taken no constitutional litmus test for any legislation that they have been passing lately. The 2010 election is the perfect time to start voting them out. It is very easy to look up their track record and how they vote on Second Amendment issues. Lets get rid of them.

I heard a guy that was a professor from Germany on short wave radio a year ago and he said he has been following the politics in America and he has concluded that the only problem the common citizens have is that the Ameican government is orginized and we are not.
If the CITIZENS become orginized and have a leader we can stop the moral and liberty eroding of our country, Gp

NEWS ALERT: NEW BILL HR 45 INTRODUCED THIS WEEK
BLAIR HOLT FIREARM LICENSING & RECORD OF SALE ACT OF 2009. GO TO ANY GOVT. WEB SITE AND TYPE IN HR 45 OR GOOGLE BLAIR HOLT FIREARM LICENSING & RECORD OF SALES ACT OF 2009. BE PREPAIRED FOR A SHOCK. OUR GREEDY,CORRUPT,LYING, DECEIVING POLITICIONS ARE OUT TO STICK IT TO US. THEY TRIED TO SNEAK THIS IN UNDER THE DOOR. I AM VERRY ANGRY OVER THE WORDIND IN THIS BILL . PLEASE EVERYONE CHECK IT OUT AND CONTACT ALL OUR CORRUPT, DECEIVING, GREEDY LYING POLITICIANS AS I AM DOING AND TELL THEM NO WAY. THANKS

To Thom Stewart:
I like your comment and agree whole heardly. I too agree with what our 2 ammendment rights are all about. Count me in the fight.

This effort in TN about guns in TN
http://www.wztv.com/newsroom/top_stories/wztv_vid_5694.shtml

Bill Would Prevent Federal Government from Regulating Firearms in TN - John Dunn

I heard that the Montana governor already signed this bill into law in Montana.
http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/2009/billpdf/HB0246.pdf

Guns made in Montana that stay in Montana are not subject to federal laws because they don't cross state lines.

"The mission of the Second Amendment March is to galvanize the courage and resolve of Americans; to petition our elected officials against establishing anti-gun legislation; and to remind America that the Second Amendment is necessary to maintain our right to self defense.

It is the one right that protects all others.

We will accomplish our mission by a peaceful march in Washington DC, the United States Capitol, supported by satellite marches to State Capitols and smaller cities all across America."

http://secondamendmentmarch.com/

"Town Hall Meetings are starting to spring up across the nation in support of the Second Amendment March. The first meeting was held on April 2, 2009 in Dorr, MI. Several more are in the works, but we need YOUR help! If you are interested in hosting a Town Hall Meeting, please contact us via our contact form. The map below lists the upcoming meetings."

An open letter to the Supreme Court of the United States of America

05/20/2009


Sirs:
I am not a lawyer, a politician, a businessman nor any other important person other than an American citizen.
I have one simple question of which I'd like an answer. I realize you are very busy so I'll make this as breif as possible, but must take some of your time in order to get my mind wrapped around this Obama birth certificate ordeal.
As I understand, many lawsuits have been thrown out because of lack of standing. May I ask who has standing if it is not the American citizen? Is it not we, the people, who are America? Do we only count at tax time or when the government wants more money or another body to wage war against our supposed enemy? Does the Constitution of the United States not give us standing when it is the citizen who that document gives authority?
If this is so, why can we not have closure on this very important matter of the qualifications of a supposed president of this nation hangs in the balance?
I believe it is imperative to our sovereignty and security to have this matter looked into and openly publicized. Such a matter as this should have been open to the public before the first vote was cast.
I ask only that the Constitution of these United States be followed in this and all matters,

A concerned American Citizen,
James Casteel

What does "lack of standing mean" ? When one of those clowns come to the hospital for a heart transplant what would they say if the doc said " sorry but you don't have the proper standing or you lack it"! Gp

So the tea bags didn’t work?

Nancy Pelosi and friends have scoffed at out tea bag protests and just to prove it when we demanded this last 600 page bill be read out loud they hired a speed reader and thumbed their collective noses at us. Well I have an idea and I need ya’lls help. My idea is to have a pink slip protest. Get yourself a few slips of pink paper, white on it in long hand “You are Fired and I am sending money to your opponent (you can put a name here).” We will all mail them to our representatives or senators on the 3rd of July which is a Friday, it will be picked up and processed over the weekend. These pink slips will most likely arrive Monday and Tuesday by the bag full. You have to realize the life blood of a campaign is money and with money going to their opponent they will get a scary message here.

I sense a protest like this, would be taken a little more seriously, not that the tea bags weren’t, but because there would be no “party/carnival” atmosphere and it takes a good bit of effort to get it done they might doubt their arrogance. Naturally this won’t work unless we ALL do it, and we get our friends to join in too. There’s a lot of tea parties planned for July 4th and with this following on Monday should get their attention, especially since it has not been sort of “commercialized” by Fox or anybody else. It will be a surprise!

You can get your representative’s address just by goggling their names, they will come up right away. I’m going to send some to Barbara Boxer, Nancy, of course, Barney Franks, Chris Dodd among others. I know I can’t vote there but they’ll get the idea.

Now, lastly, if you folks think this is stupid then send me your comments and I’ll drop the whole idea, but if you like it, say so and let’s help each other get the message out there. So let me thank you all, in advance for your concern and love of this country.

JD, I love your idea and I will be sending my pink slip to all of them. Also, I think everyone should go to the election office and if you are associated with either the Democrat or Republican party then ask them to change it to either independent or the Constitution party. Let them know we are no longer accepting either party unless they start representing We the People.

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2009/aug/26/when-politicians-and-guns-get-together/

Having played football, hockey, b-ball, baseball and other sports with a ball, now look at golf, and being a member of the Tactical Shooters association and IPSC, I have to clearly agree with Thomas Jefferson.

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be your constant companion of your walks." --Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, 1785