Why "Conservatives" Hate Trump

[Oren Long]

Yesterday Rush Limbaugh was going over why so-called Conservatives, including politicians and  Bloggers, hate Trump.   I have a different take.   I hope you enjoy it.

There is a very simple reason the above hate Trump -- JEALOUSY, EMBARRASSMENT, AND BEING EXPOSED FOR THE FRAUDS THEY ARE!

Within a very short time Trump has accomplished what all of these "sophisticates" could not or would not do.   It embarrasses them and exposes their collective incompetence and hypocrisy.   In their world it is not only O.K. to lie and cheat (especially to the public and voters), it is EXPECTED!   It's just what they do.

BUT, when Trump actually KEEPS his promises, it exposes them for the lying, incompetent hypocrites they really are, and that's not allowed.

They SAID they wanted tax reform -- Trump did it!

They SAID they wanted to stop the Illegal Invaders -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted to reduce Federal Regulations -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted conservative judges and justices -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted to make inroads into minority voting blocs -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted trade deals that are good for America -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted a strong economy -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted to reduce unemployment -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted to keep jobs in America -- Trump is doing it!

They SAID they wanted to stop terrorism and kill ISIS -- Trump is doing it!

Trump is doing everything they SAID they wanted to do but were unable or unwilling to do.

It fully exposes their lying incompetence and they are embarrassed by it.   A "rude, crude, lewd, dude" does what their "sophisticated, Inside the Beltway" methods could not or would not do.   They're not embarrassed that he's President' they're embarrassed that he's succeeding and keeping promises, promises that they could not or would not keep.   It makes them look bad.  

They don't want him gone because he's bad for America; they want him gone because he's bad for THEM.

THEY ARE JEALOUS AS HELL AND EMBARRASSED TO BOOT!

They call Trump a "bumbling idiot", but Trump is exposing THEM as the bumbling idiots.

If President Trump was assassinated, they would cry their crocodile tears in public and pop champagne corks in private.   Then, it would be back to "business as usual".

Karl Rove, George Will, the Liberal Media, and faux "conservative" bloggers are perfect examples.   They are perennial failures, yet remain favorites of the Elite.   To them, it is O.K. to fail as long as you do it by the "rules" and they get credit.   Trump doesn't play by the rules and sure doesn't give them credit.   That is what angers and embarrasses them.   Bob Dylan said it best, "He knows there's no success like failure, and failure's no success at all".  

Oren Long 

[M]

Very insightful Oren.

M

[Thomas Vincent Coffey]

Those either applying or claiming the descriptive conservative wouldn't know conservatism from vegetarianism; among them clowns such as Rove and Will.

Principled Conservatism, at its core, is an aggregation of attitudes and behaviors about human nature derivative of the eternal truths of the Natural Law; having virtual nothing to do w/either politics or economics.

Trump may be many thing but most certainly, he will never be conflated w/either Pericles or Palmerston.

For the record, the definitive description of Conservatism was codified by Russell Kirk, a disciple of Edmund Burke, in his essays for the Heritage Foundation.

[John S Hutchinson]

Thomas,

Your attempting to describe Conservatism while claiming it has nothing to do with Politics nor Economics?

So Fiscal Conservatism has nothing to do with economics than how would you explain the lack of Fiscal Conservatism? Most of us refer to it as Socialism, Socialistic, the paving stones to Communism,

Fiscal Conservatism is based on wealth generation; not the confiscation of wealth under Fiscal Socialistic Policies.

Politics, the art of reason, is based upon the objective views of an individual representing many. Conservatism strives for a level playing field, equality and the burden of the purse to be shared by all. While at the opposite end of the Political Spectrum lay's Socialism, the victimization of one group for the benefit of another group.

As for the Principled Conservatism you grabble with you leave your own opinion open to a multitude of interpretations!  I mean there are seven billion humans in the world, just which ones of their view of eternal law and Natural Law do you wish to bring to the top?

[John S Hutchinson]

An important topic,

However I know you and Rush both to be in error, but on the right path.

Let me explain,

Most Republicans and a slim few Democrats are truly Conservative. And even then even fewer follow their own convictions by actually applying the guidelines of Conservatism to themselves. There are also several types of Conservatives. Their are Fiscal Conservatives and their are Constitutional Conservatives to name the main branches of Conservatism. And very few Americans can honestly lay claim to being both.

And that is truly the rub, the fly in the ointment, the reversed view of oneself staring back from the mirror.

If your a true Constitutional Conservative than you have no choice but to acknowledge that the Constitution provides for the same rights to all Americans.

I know, I know, Most self proclaimed "Conservatives" will claim that is their stance, then in the next breath claim the Constitution also defends their own views and condemns the views or lessons the rights of others when it does not.

Now, The Constitution clearly allows for the protection of the rights for all American's absolutely, "As long of in the pursuit of those rights "We do not infringe upon the rights of others". That is beautiful, balanced and poetic.

Then there are Fiscal Conservatives. If your a Mid West Farmer that voted for President Trump and are receiving Farm Subsidies in one form or another your are certainly not a Fiscal Conservative and should not be surprised when the President starts cutting your welfare back. That is what it is, welfare.

So while true Fiscal and Constitutional Conservatives like myself thank all those who voted to place Trump on the Bone Throne so he could unleash his wrath upon all the unclean residing in the swamp I would also advise them to prepare themselves for the future when President Trump's attention turns to their own Socialistic piece of the static pie.

For Washington DC is like a Brothel, no one sees or hears anything. But let one secret slip and it will spread like the Black Plague following the Christian Inquisition in Europe.        

[Oren Long]

John,

Thank you for responding.

I can make an argument for your post, and just as good an argument against it.   But, that's not the point.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you are saying that there are damned few true [classical] conservatives left.   I'll give you that.   I count myself among that august few, but at the same time, realize that I have to live in the real world of current events.   For example, I could refuse my Social Security and my government retirement (in the name of Constitutional purity), but then I would die; I'm too old to work.  

You said, "The Constitution clearly allows for the protection of the rights for all Americans, absolutely . . ."   Well, yes and no.   The Constitution guarantees CERTAIN rights (think Bill of Rights) for Citizens, but denies them to others.   The fact that courts have gradually expanded the definition of "Rights" beyond the wildest nightmares of all reason is another topic for another day.   The fact that the Constitution has gradually been redefined into a cornerstone of Socialist 'equality' is yet another topic for yet another day.

To me, the function, purpose, and definition of the Constitution can best be summed up as guaranteeing "Freedom".   In turn, Freedom can best be defined as "Opportunity and Responsibility".   Everyone has an Opportunity to do and be whatever they strive for.   But, they are Responsible in that effort and for the results.   It's that simple.

That said, all I was trying to point out was why the Elite hate Trump.   That's it.

Oren 

[John S Hutchinson]

Thanks for the great reply Oren,

You said,

 In turn, Freedom can best be defined as "Opportunity and Responsibility".   Everyone has an Opportunity to do and be whatever they strive for.

...... and be responsible for the outcome, good or bad,

However, the Bill of Rights does provide for a balance of opportunity and responsibility for all Americans, even though many feel it does not.

I too feel I am one of the few that is and will remain a true Fiscal and Constitutional Conservative. That you except your SS is not going against your Conservative stance, not at all.

You see I am a business owner and I shell out a modest fortune each month on SS health care and retirement pensions for all my employees. By law I have no choice. And by law my employees do not have a choice but except these benefits. That does not mean we except the tenants of Socialism.

The reason is very simple. If my business was not forced to pay out $3,000.00+ per month in health, dental and eye insurance FOR EACH EMPLOYEE, and $2,000.00 in pension payments, and so on my company would be paying our most or all of that amount in increased payroll to the employees in order to attract the best employees.

So it is Socialistic for the government to force my firm to be a nanny to all my employees and to force my employees to except it in order to survive, but that just means our government is Socialistic in nature and does not mean we are so.

The doctrine of forced Socialism is a stain on the government that does so, not on the people it applies it to,

And it is both Republicans and Democrats that force Socialism on the population. Why? Simply to gain votes for the purpose or retaining power, pure and simple.

But when the government, regardless of what party, enslaves part of the population for the advancement of another through an imbalance in taxation it is nothing but pure robbery.

As for the elite hating trump they have very good reasons to do so. Trump is the single largest threat of utter destruction to their grip on power since this nation was founded. He does not need to share their power base, not at all.

And you will see the creatures of the swamp crawl out of their shallow pits spewing all sorts of vile fluids and gasses and screaming all their rages as the 2020 elections approach. So if you do not have a board with a nail in the end of it to beat them back get one and a large container of disinfectant.

[M]

Draining the swamp the Right Way/By Making it Permanent

Most people here complain about the dirty deal Obama gave us, and lionize Trump for attempting to set things straight.

We want him to keep draining the swamp.

We are sitting here feeling good about what he has done, and what he will potentially continue to do.

We tend to forget that everything Trump has done to help America can vanish overnight.

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Nothing that has been done is final. Case in point;The 111th Congress without the help of even one Republican imposed Obamacare on the American people, of which the vast majority did not want it.Look at the continuing mess it has caused and will keep causing. Look at what Trump has done to reverse Obama's fiasco. He has repealed ten things Obama pushed on us, he got a tax abatement, he started draining the denizens of the swamp. This is good but not relatively permanent.

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However none of the things he has done, none of the laws he has signed into existence has any permanence. Any or all of them can be reversed as easily as Obamacare was pushed on us, provided the voters put in Progressives instead of Conservatives. Anything can be eliminated as easily as the new tax law has eliminated the mandate provision. There is a distinct possibility the next President or Liberal Congress will reverse everything Trump has done.

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What we need to do is to get an article V amendment proposal convention, petitioned for by the State Legislatures, so it will be the people instead of Congress, who propose amendments. Many people on both sides say what use is it to make new amendments because the Congress or President do not follow the Constitution any way. That is not true. They do follow it Even SCOTUS follows it. The problem being is the existing Amendments from 11 on have been proposed solely by Congress itself and for it's own benefit, not the publics.

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Originally our Founders created the Constitution out of the old articles of the Confederation of the United States of America. It provided the chains on the Federal Central Government to keep it in check, and the power in the hands of the people. It proved too unwieldy and the Founders created the Constitution for the same purpose. The Constitution was written in such a way that it was in Two basic parts; The original Document and the Amendments. 

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Article V was created in the original document to allow for amendments as time went by, the people or the peoples representatives in Congress could update and modify without changing one word of the original. They made it hard to create amendments, but they made it possible so the people could make changes they collectively decided were reasonable and necessary. As it is now, it was the Congress who has made every single proposal for an amendment, and not one has came from the people themselves. This situation is the reason the Federal Government has grown in power and size way beyond anything reasonable.

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As we all know the Civil war was fought over Slavery and States Rights being Superior to Federal rights. the amendment Congress (All Northern Senators by the way) forced on the South basically at the point of the guns of occupying GAR troops, and the refusal (unconstitutional by the way, no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate" ), of denying the States in the Rebellion from taking their seats until they signed the 14th Amendment.Which is what the Northern States did 

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That 14th Amendment was supposedly created only to give citizenship and voting rights to the freed Slaves. However they inserted three toxic words ( No State Shall ) into it that changed the flow of power from the People to the States and from the States to the Federal Government into, the Federal Government over the States and the States over the people who originally were meant to be the highest political power in the United States.

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In it's rulings over time SCOTUS has cemented that power flow by abusing the meaning of the 14th and using it as a club over the States and people. Every ruling against the peoples wishes has stemmed from those three words. Those three words has stolen the peoples rightful power over their government and gave it to the charlatans in politics.

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This is the reason that anything done by Presidents or Congress or even the people is only transient and can be easily overturned. Case in point; When Congress wanted to increase the taxes collected they originally legislated an income tax. That tax was declared unconstitutional by Scotus. Congress retaliated by calling an article V convention and came up with the 16th Amendment for their benefit bluffing the people into ratifying it. The same happened when the political parties wanted Senators to be loyal to their party and not to the States who they represented so they created the 17th Amendment. The rest is history.

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These are things the public either does not see or can not see being blinded by the dog and pony shows of modern politics. Unless and until we band together and order our legislatures to petition for an Article V where it is the people themselves who propose Amendments Like a balanced budget amendment with severe penalties to Congress for not creating a budget. Or, for a true and binding term limit for all congress, even repealing the 16th and replacing it with a National Sales Tax of say 5% ( must be done concurrently within the new amendment to prevent Congress from adding a new tax without removing the income tax. ) or repealing the 17th and putting the Senators back under the control of State Legislatures as was originally intended. Even ones creating language to keep the best things Trump has done as law of the land even SCOTUS can not reverse, the people will be at the mercy of politicians who believe themselves to be the masters instead of the hired hands.

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Right now under Trump is the best ever situation where the people can push this through. See; http://www.articlevprojecttorestoreliberty.com/index.html  the free online library that is dedicated to make changes for the better permanent and controlled by the will of the people instead of by the will of self serving political hacks.

[Oren Long]

M,

I really enjoyed your post!

I have been thinking about adding a new Discussion so members can discuss an Article V Convention of States.

As part of that post I would submit my proposed amendments that I have been working on for almost nine years.   They cover everything you touched on in your post, and more.

Your thoughts?

Oren

[M]

Oren,

Sounds like something that would really encourage diverse viewpoints to be aired. I say go for it.

M

[John S Hutchinson]

Great post M,

And I will respond to several points you made however I will respond to one of them now.

The Civil War was not fought over slavery. The end of slavery was one of the many good things that resulted from the war however.

The Civil War was fought over taxation. The taxing of goods and produce generated in the South for the construction of roads in the North. Pure and simple.

The ending of slavery was a byproduct of the outcome, nothing more. Even Lincoln stated so and it is etched in stone at the Lincoln Memorial.  

It was unfair taxation that caused the Civil War, the Revolutionary War, the Whisky Rebellion and so many other wars and struggles.

It is also causing the enslavement of a portion of America for the benefit of others through Socialistic wealth distribution,

[M]

John,

In addition to taxation there was the Northern Bankers foreclosing on Southern properties using Northern laws instead of the State laws concerning it. Slavery was an issue, The South wanted it in perpetuity and the abolitionists did not. Those were the things I put under the catch all States Rights vs Federal Rights. At that time it was popular in the North to conveniently ignore the fact that each state in the union was in fact a sovereign nation unto itself but banded together for mutual protection. The North in winning destroyed that concept as a working hypothesis relegating it to a footnote in history. The 14th amendment over rode the validity of the 10th with the three words "No State Shall" Since then every case based on the 10th has been thrown out by SCOTUS using the 14th as the hammer. See; http://www.14thamendment.us/amendment/14th_amendment.html  for a clarification of what the 14th was originally intended for by Senators who were there when it was enacted.

[Thomas Vincent Coffey]

The core cause of our Civil War was slavery which was entwined w/ the primacy of States Rights, a political concept fathered by the likes of Jefferson, Madison, Henry, Rutledge, Calhoun; among others. Taxation is malarkey having nothing to do w/it.

The Civil War commenced in March of 1861 while the Revenue Act imposing personal taxation was enacted later the same year (and repealed in 1872). As such, taxation is impossible to have been a catalyst for the war!!!

The South was agrarian, supporting free trade and financing itself by exporting raw cotton to the great mills of Birmingham and Manchester.

In contrast, the North was pre-industrial, supporting protectionism and financing itself by an early form of VAT for its infrastructure needs.

This difference helped widen the economic gap between North and South.